About Godstims and Stims production in general

SubjectD9341 · October 27, 2024, 3:26pm

Im gonna kill u

N.H.C · October 27, 2024, 3:31pm

DukeofCagliostro · October 27, 2024, 4:34pm

Removing research is removing soul. Hard pass.

RainbowStalin · October 27, 2024, 9:55pm

Eh. I’d just put a freeze on stimms instead. Let research research stuff. Let them do new shit. Let them experiment with different cipherings. Something.

N.H.C · October 27, 2024, 10:00pm

A freeze on stims? You mean like, disable them?

RainbowStalin · October 27, 2024, 10:45pm

Make it so the synthetic simulator cannot modify “stim” chemicals. Like either make them all take a ludicrus amount of points to do, or something else. Then keep in all the mundane and researchy properties. Like ciphering, anti-hallucinogenic, Relaxing, etc.

Because theres nothing wrong with the researchers and the jobs, just the stim part of it.

N.H.C · October 28, 2024, 1:17am

So you want the main gameplay loop of research to be heavily restricted by nerfing benifitial medical propertys. Specificly the ability to use them in custome chemicals. And then have an underrepresented gameplay loop expanded upon wich consists of… greenos and customs chemicals for weapons.

Just with less time and more work to do so. Needing to balance every change properly and in a timly manner to not effect the game too much.
Instead of having research temporarly removed to give it time and space to be fully reworked while it doesnt impete on the rest of the game.

Did i get that rigth?

somerandomguy3124 · October 28, 2024, 1:17am

github.com/cmss13-devs/cmss13

Research Rework Part Two: The Contract System.

cmss13-devs:master ← kiVts:xenos

opened 05:54AM - 24 Aug 24 UTC

kiVts

+995 -927

# About the pull request Massively revamps the main gameplay loop of research…, Tons of changes, an attempt to make research more independent and less afk based gameplay, There are tons of changes to be covered. To start, research had their passive gain nuked completely. They now get a free chemical to pick every 5 minutes(Subject to change) (2 if none picked(Subject to change)), with three levels of difficulty, with hard having hydro-exclusive chemicals, credit reward is substantially higher though, so think carefully. Create mode was also removed, the cornerstone of every godstim, impossible to balance in a way to make not hoarding points the best way without hindering the other more healthier options. As a counterbalance, randomly generated chemicals have had their OD average increased considerably, and a new "ADD" mode, in which you can add a property from reference chemical without downsides to the target chemical, however the reference chemical will refuse any further interactions in the simulator(Subject to change). Legendary properties are no longer generated in the chemicals, instead, they're now assigned 3 properties randomly each round, which when mixed, combines into the property. Documents telling exactly which properties can be found groundside, for that reason, recent legendary properties nerfs are reverted back into their original form. Ciphering also falls into the same fate, Royal plasma now has "Encrypted" property (Subject to change), which is only one key out of four to making ciphering, a minor hint is found in CMO office, while the rest in groundside. Pregenerated chemicals are removed, Those are the chemicals you would encounter in the hydro plants, Groundside vials, and researcher labcoat. Groundside vials now only contain extremely rare chemicals like Thwei, and etc, the chance to have such vials are lowered substantially. Hydro has 10(9? I forgot) new chemicals exclusive to them, all of them are also exclusive to certain plants, and most of them exist in the real world (Albeit, the plants you find them in are not), those pop up in the hard tier chemicals mentioned earlier. Credit disks in the dissection analyzer are replaced for contract reroll, buying which will instantly reroll the contracts, bought or not.(Subject to change) WIP, although most of it is done, I need to do some massive polish and repair. (seed datum code, look at it its insane) PRed so I can track the changes more easily and Im rapidly approaching the end. This will also need a huge amount of price and rarity balance, perhaps the most pain will be brought by property generation. Hard tier contracts require hydro exclusive chemicals, Essentially those are the chemicals that are only acquired via mutation of various plants. Namely: Urishiol is found in death nettle Zygacine In reishi mushrooms Digoxin in Predator burn kit (hack the seed vendor Atropine in Poppies Psoralen In Cabbage Coniine And Phenol in Carrots Thymol is found in death berries.(mutation of berries) # Explain why it's good for the game Research suffers from huge amounts of issues to the point that writing them out here would take hours, however there are main things to point out Meta - The research meta was often attempted to be destroyed, the result was often, disappointing and nerfs only swirled up the meta, if at all (example being MST recieving 3(4?) nerfs in the years of researching), This way we attempt to - Effectively knock down godstims, forcing research to build up from ground to it - heavily promote multiple chemicals being deployed - Promote more creativity, at least in a way off "how to relate/add/amplify it the most efficient way." AFK/Heavily groundside reliant gameplay - The passive gain would heavily promote to just afk out of boredom, and the huge reliance on groundside IOs is not exactly healthy for the department, their perfomance being largely out of their hands. We try to fix this, by - Nuking passive gain, if you want to have good perfomance, you'll need to perform great art of teamwork of growing plants and mixing the chemicals. - Making IOs strictly boost the research department, by bringing up the legendary properties documents and simular ciphering documents.. <details> <summary>Screenshots & Videos</summary> Put screenshots and videos here with an empty line between the screenshots and the `<details>` tags. </details> # Changelog :cl: del: Create mode is removed del: Chemicals that appear in vials are gone, xeno plasma still appears in the vials. add: Contract system for research, Research gets a choice of 3 chemicals every 5 minutes (2 if not picked), of random difficulty. Level of difficulty affects the quality of properties and complexity of the recipe, however, the harder - the more points you get to manipulate the chemical in synthesis simulator. add: ADD mode in synthesis simulator, This is a replacement to CREATE mode, in this mode you can add a property to target chemical at no disadvantage for the target chemical, however the reference chemical is "damage" and simulator wont accept it anymore. add: 9 Hydro exclusive chemicals. Atropine, more powerful epinephrine but deals brain damage, Thymol an extremely weak anti parasitic, Psoralen a powerful carcinogenic and more. Found only in certain plants during a mutagenic process. del: Passive income for research is removed. add: Legendary properties will not generate in chemicals anymore, instead they're now assigned 3 properties to combine from, similar applies to ciphering. balance: Regulating, MST and NST nerf is reverted /:cl:

kiVts · October 28, 2024, 1:27am

Research is not getting removed, disabled, even temporarily. Unless something very bad happens, it stays.

ihatethisengine · October 28, 2024, 8:23am

So you think that when stims let a guy outheal four xenos slashing him is not “very bad”?

osmos · October 28, 2024, 8:38am

The age of Godstims and OT is over. Millions must cade hug and delay the round.

RainbowStalin · October 28, 2024, 9:23am

If research is nothing to you without stims, then you don’t want research. We already have bio matter and all it’s beneficial, and you can even still use Xeno blood for “stims”, if need be.

sg2002 · October 28, 2024, 9:31am

Welcome to the wonderful world of Research mains. The popular sentiment there is this: If I can’t completely break the entire round in 10 minutes, then it means that my role is completely unplayable.

Also, that’s why I don’t think that any broadly accepted compromise in terms of Research power is possible. The xenomains think that the current Research is at 300% of what it should be. While the RSR mains think that currently it’s at 10%, where roundstart godstims through transfer would be 70% and I can’t even think what 100% is to them. So while the xenomains are too busy REEEing about a million nerf attempts on them, the Researcher mains would just keep buffing Research.

RainbowStalin · October 28, 2024, 10:23am

I got about 150 hours in research, where maybe 10 of those were having fun with stims. It gets stale real fast when you are basically doing the same shit every round, and you got that one dude who wants to do that same stim for the 50th time in a row.

Meanwhile greeno rp, CL rp, admin events and so on just make the role actually fun to be.

Edit: Stims are suffering from the same things as current OT. You join, you do your OP combo whatever, and then ghost to see how it goes.

SubjectD9341 · October 28, 2024, 10:26am

Dude I don’t get how you think this when almost all of us actual researcher mains are trying to move away from stims.

Quit it with the strawmans or something

Funnily enough, I feel like people supporting stims as of now is PFCs and command as a way to smash xenos later in a round

Swagile · October 28, 2024, 7:00pm

I want research to be less about a spreadsheet on Excel and spamming an OP combo to about giving helpful tools to marines like Nanosplints.

I actually rolled Researcher once to try and do that, and a fellow Researcher wanted to do the same thing, but then a experienced Research looked at our point purchases (he was a plat researcher im guessing) and had a baby rage meltdown about “WHO SPENT ALL OUR POINTS ON NANO SPLINTS!!!?!?!?!?!?!?”

I can get why he was angry, because we had no points for stim clearance, but at the same time stims are so oppressively overpowered if you know how to game them that there is no point in buying anything else EXCEPT stims, which is not good for gameplay. It makes every round boring.

Willzadl · October 28, 2024, 8:03pm

spending all of the point on nanosplints is pretty uncool though to be fair…

GoldenDarkness · October 28, 2024, 9:36pm

Nuke stims and all the changes introduced only to make getting stims harder and actually re-focus the department to consistently produce not-gamechanging-but-useful stuff like the plasma removing gas, nanosplints etc.
Any year now.

system · January 26, 2025, 9:36pm

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