b00tybandit - Player Report: Michael 'Ponyboy' Calhoun, Permanent Removal, Exploiting, Battlefield Executions

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b00tybandit - Player Report: Michael ‘Ponyboy’ Calhoun, Permanent Removal, Exploiting, Battlefield Executions

What’s your BYOND key?

b00tybandit

Round ID:

29842

Your character name:

Richter von Sosa

Accused character name:

Michael ‘Ponyboy’ Calhoun

What rule(s) were broken?:

Permanent Removal, Exploiting, Battlefield Executions

Description of the incident:

This is not a WL Report as WL Reports, per the forum description, requires the report to be about a WL Rule breach.

This is not a salt report as I don’t really care other than it being a CO breaking a rule. I’m not mad. It was end-of-round but I’ve been told repeatedly that standards still apply there – I’m even noted for being LRP at end-of-round. I don’t understand the weird gaslighting going on in Sippy_the_kot’s thread. Is the server HRP only when it’s convenient? I don’t think so.

"Permanently removing a player from the round by using brute force, or preventing them from being treated, is considered as griefing, even if they belong to a hostile faction.

Example to above could be shooting a revivable player’s corpse until you rip their head off.

Queen’s Banishment, Battlefield Executions, Authorized Executions and Warrior’s ability, are exceptions to this rule and are evaluated on a case-by-case basis."

This report, is the case-by-case basis.

Let’s begin –

SCENARIO: It was an end-of-round CLF boarding. Michael ‘Ponyboy’ Calhoun went to all the already-dead CLF corpses and Battlefield Executed their dead bodies to prevent revival, as there was still CLF on board that could revive them. He did this to at least 4 corpses. I suspect more.

  1. Was this exploiting?
    Arguably, yes. How do you execute someone that’s already dead?

  2. But it’s just end-of-round/CLF boarding event, does it matter?
    Yes. It is an HRP server and HRP is enforced, I’ve got plenty of notes myself to that end.

  3. Do we actually enforce this rule?
    Yes. Here is a member of the CO Whitelist, Arbs, being warned for gibbing CLF with C4: BorisTheLove - Player Report: Alan Jones, Rule 2 - Roleplay, Rule 4 - No griefing (that’s nothing against Alan Jones, I love his CO, it’s just an example of standards)

  4. But Arbs wasn’t CO at the time, he was an SO!
    So if Arbs was a CO it would’ve been OK?
    He is a member of the CO whitelist.
    There was a CO watching him do this, that did not protest against it/stop him.
    He still got warned for it.

  5. It doesn’t matter
    Do you want xenos to wall off your corpse, or do you want a lone CLF synth C4ing you on the Almayer?

  6. But he’s a CO, he SHOULD be the exception, he SHOULD be allowed to break rules that others can’t
    This is not a Whitelist Report, but I know this point was already brought up in OOC and in Sippy’s thread and it’ll get brought up again. So, first, per the Code of Conduct that kept getting brought up

“A threat to the ship or operation… persons… [or] command.”

They were dead. They were not a threat. I re-iterate, I don’t know how you’re going to execute someone who’s already dead. In fact, the server rules say that BEs are for “instantly [killing]”, not “tactical permadeath”.

“… an announcement must be made within a reasonable time explaining why the person was executed and noting their name and position.”

This was not done.

So the BEs were neither executions, nor done for the purpose of “[killing]”, nor done within CO policy. Re: the latter, yes this isn’t a whitelist report but I felt it’d validate me saying that these weren’t really BEs

As I know this is handled case-by-case per the rule:

Admins, if you were running a major event w/ hostile parties, would you allow the CO to run around perma-killing every already-dead hostile player to prevent their revival by hostile medics? Is this good for the game? That’s what happened here, just no one cares because it was at round-end ---- but people get noted/warned/banned for round-end shenanigans all the time

They solely used the BE mechanic for a gameplay advantage. This was done not for RP, nor for the fun of players in the game, nor for the good of the round. It was done to “win”, and I expect that this player would do the same to CLF boarding mid-round.

Followup:

Sippy_kot’s thread was “solved” with this post:

I know this must be frustrating for you but there are pre-established guidelines for when and how you can Battlefield execute someone.

A CLF ERT is absolutely liable to be shot and executed by the CO when terrorists board the ship with the intent to fight and kill the USCM.

Any protection you thought you had immediately goes out the window on that. Its not a battlefield execution, it is simply a use of his gun to kill CLF that were already hostile.

The CO didn’t do any executions. He, as Death himself, used BE to send 4+ fully revivable corpses to perma status.

Why can’t other players do this?

If I go blow the head off a CLF corpse, or as a hostile boarder, I hide the body of a marine, right now, I will be banned. That is a fact.

That’s all. There was no BEing; only extremely intentional permanent round removals of already-handled threats, IDENTICAL to C4ing a corpse or beheading a corpse or any of the other things people very consistently get banned for.

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If I hide your character’s corpse or otherwise make your character unrevivable, I know for a fact you will ahelp me and try to get me banned. I really feel insane trying to explain this, but I hope you know it’s nothing personal

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I’m going to formally reply to this for the purpose of explaining my reasoning and what has been general CO WL policy for a number of years now.

Firstly, it is entirely within a CO’s rights to BE individuals for the following:

  • A threat to persons. Credibly threatening and attempting to do harm to the Commanding Officer or to someone while in the Commanding Officer’s presence.
  • A threat to the ship or operation. Credibly threatening or attempting to do damage to the ship, the USCM, or operation while in the Commanding Officer’s presence.

The CLF ERT presented a threat to myself (having shot at me), my crew (having shot at the CMP, XO, and several others in my presence), and the ship at large (having illegally boarded it with the intent of killing all onboard).

When they were downed they remained a threat to myself, the crew, and the ship because there remained the possibility that CLF elements still on board the ship would go to revive them and continue the conflict. I had been made aware that, while I was fighting in the middle deck, both my XO and CMP had been killed in CIC. Operating with the best interests of my marines in mind, I had to assume that if one wave of CLF was coming it would be likely that more would follow. If you were to look in logs you would see me in the CIC ordering medics to not care for the CLF and instead focus on the marines.

In the midst of me trying to organize triage for the several wounded and dead marines, the UPP then invade the ship. There was no reasonable expectation that, when the ship is being actively boarded, I would go to look for every single CLF guerilla that I had shot to announce a BE. Those announcements assume the CO is not wrapped in a crisis, and are most readily meant to apply to Almayer Crew where the reasoning for the BE is less than obvious.

Battlefield Executions are indeed a mechanic, but it’s a mechanic locked behind a whitelist where applicants are vetted and watched for between 2-3 weeks to ensure they won’t abuse it. COs are trusted not to abuse that tool and to use it in the best interest of the round and with responsibility for the marines under their command. I would argue that it would be irresponsible (and borderline LRP) to not use the abilities trusted to me to defend and save as many marine lives as possible in these circumstances.

Lastly, this is an ERT coming at the end of a round with the understanding that, yes, you are here with the sole purpose of killing the marines and fighting while admins sort out some sort of moderation action. This wasn’t a regular HvH round with in depth and meaningful RP that was painstakingly organized, mapped out, and coded ahead of time. This was a “here is something to do so you’re not bored.” If you don’t believe me, here is what Forest said himself in LRC.

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I don’t want to turn this into a series of threads where we fling shit at one another, but I do find it incredibly dishonest to compare a mechanic locked behind a whitelist with a 2-3 week application process to dragging somebody’s body off and throwing it in a locker or some other dark corner.

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When they were downed they remained a threat to the XO as well (or literally anyone, XO is just good example), the crew, and the ship because there remained the possibility that CLF elements still on board the ship would go to revive them and continue the conflict.

But if the XO magdumped a shotgun to behead them while they were already dead, the XO would be noted/banned/etc. – the way you are using BE here isn’t as a BE, it’s solely as a mechanic to perma people and in this case functions no differently than C4ing a corpse or hiding a body. That is against the rules.

a mechanic locked behind a whitelist

This means nothing here because you aren’t performing a Battlefield Execution, you’re running around to already dead people and popping them in the head. In fact, C4ing them would be harder, it takes more time to perform.

However like you said I don’t think this is a point you and I will agree on, so we can just leave it there and see what the decision is. Thank you for responding seriously and taking the time to type that out, I appreciate it

I KNOW you weren’t griefing or being malicious but I’m not confident you wouldn’t do this mid-round (esp re: the “borderline LRP” part of your post), this player report is ultimately about the principle. Even i know the ruling will probably favor your end but it is case by case so i’d rather make this stand now rather than later when i’m the one getting permadeath’d

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Player Report Denied

Also, we’re a MEDIUM-ROLEPLAY server, and therefore our expectations are not of a HRP or LRP server - rather somewhere in between.

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