Butlerblock - Player Report: Nathan, "Combat and you. Synthetic Combat Restrictions"

Butlerblock · February 12, 2024, 6:59pm

Butlerblock - Player Report: Nathan, “Combat and you. Synthetic Combat Restrictions”

What’s your BYOND key?

Butlerblock

Round ID:

20852

Your character name:

Prime Lurker (BUT-37)

Accused BYOND key:

InsaneRed

Accused character name:

Nathan

What rule(s) were broken?:

“Combat and you. Synthetic Combat Restrictions”

Description of the incident:

Throughout the round, Nathan carried a flame sentry(from what I could tell, everywhere they went), following marine pushes. On one particular marine flank near the end of the game in which marines were trying to flank a xeno siege on comms, Nathan followed the marines in and instantly placed a flame sentry due to their synth skills and turned it on, and then proceeded to spend their time during that battle repairing the sentry or warding xenos off of it with a baton. While it is not directly stated that a synthetic cannot deploy sentries, I believe that this scenario constitutes the synthetic indirectly using weaponry to combat and kill xenos.

Evidence:

Deploying a sentry does not give direct names, but I have included a screenshot of a sentry being deployed anonymously, and then soon after being repaired by the accused.

Butlerblock · February 12, 2024, 7:58pm

After a relatively short discussion with the accused and others in LRC, I would like to clarify that this report is purely claiming that Nathan did nothing wrong other than using a flame sentry as a medium of a ranged weapon. After understanding their thought process, I believe they did not break the rule of combat synthing outside of self defense and guarding.

Despite their justification of placing the sentry to guard marines while they heal/protect them, I believe that these ends do not justify the means, and that, under the current wording of the synthetic rules, a violation of the synth code had occured.

I would also like to note that I have nothing against InsaneRed, the player of Nathan, and that while they had good intentions, a rule had been broken. The only reason I did not approach them outside of a report is because I knew that it would not lead anywhere due to their previous nature within the discord, as proven in LRC.

I believe that one of the two things should 100% happen as a result of this report: Either A, InsaneRed is given at the minimum a warning, or B, the rules should be clarified to define what an indirect weapon constitutes(If the accused is shown innocent).

ihatethisengine · February 13, 2024, 2:33pm

I participated in the round (played as lurker, I wasn’t harmed by the accused directly) and witnessed Nathan using the blue flame sentry in two occurrences:

Occurrence one: the synth and another marine were near secondary comms, north (FOB was south LZ). The accused put his flamer sentry in the grass south of the comms, facing also south. He and the marine were standing in the sentry zone of fire, in order (from my perspective) to bait backliners to attack them so the backliners would be ambushed by the hidden sentry. The accused stated in discord that he merely wanted to secure second comms for the nuke, but again, the sentry wasn’t covering the comms, rather than the backline (also comms weren’t repaired nor caded). And the placement of the sentry in the grass also gives away the intent to catch xenos by surprise, rather than to discourage them from attacking.

Occurrence two: mentioned by the OP. Xenos were besieging the second comms later in the round, and were resting behind a wall. The accused (and I suppose some force of marines) flanked them, the accused placed the sentry the way it immediately started to shooting resting xenos. Again, in discord the accused stated that he merely was securing the perimeter to protect marines, but again, I don’t believe this is true, as it was a flanking maneuver.

In any way, I agree with the OP that placing sentries in combat seems to me against the spirit of synth guidelines, even though it’s not stated directly.

Synthetics are forbidden from firing any weapons, including direct fire emplacements (M56Ds) and indirect weaponry, such as CAS, the M402 Mortar, and OBs. However, they are not opposed to other humans harming/killing others provided it follows Marine Law. If there is a threat within the bounds of Marine Law, they can physically defend themselves or other innocents by subduing the threat non-lethally.

It seems to me that the use of sentries in active combat (and in backline) falls under the use of indirect weaponry. I can understand how a synth moves the sentry in the FOB to a better position, outside of an active siege. But deliberately carrying a sentry for use in active combat strikes me as a violation of the rules. Hunting the backline with a sentry as a synth also seems like a clear violation of the rules to me.

Nothing personal to InsaneRed too, but it feels like an obvious attempt to circumvent the rules of synth combat to get an advantage in combat as a synth.

I want to mention this too, but this is the first time in years I see a synth deliberately carrying a sentry. I played engineer a lot of time and from what I have seen, if a synth finds a sentry, they usually give it away to the closest engineer immediately. For me, the fact the accused was carrying the sentry for the huge portion of the round clearly shows his intent to use it in combat.

NessiePendragon · February 13, 2024, 6:01pm

Added report:synth

Vyzo · February 14, 2024, 7:30pm

Pulling Logs

Vyzo · March 4, 2024, 5:51am

Apologies for the delay, personal health and uni come first

Butlerblock- Reporter
InsaneRed - Reported
Bystanders

Initial Contact and Death

ATTACK: Byron Paynter blew up Butlerblock/(Mature Defender (BUT-578)) with a M40 HEDP grenade in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (54,65,2).

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Mature Defender (BUT-578)) was harmed by explosion in Cryo-Thermal Marshes caused by M40 HEDP grenade at (54,65,2)

ATTACK: Byron Paynter blew up Butlerblock/(Mature Defender (BUT-578)) with a M40 HEDP grenade in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (53,65,2).

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Mature Defender (BUT-578)) was harmed by explosion in Cryo-Thermal Marshes caused by M40 HEDP grenade at (53,65,2)

ATTACK: Byron Paynter blew up Butlerblock/(Mature Defender (BUT-578)) with a M40 HEDP grenade in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (53,65,2).

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Mature Defender (BUT-578)) was harmed by explosion in Cryo-Thermal Marshes caused by M40 HEDP grenade at (53,65,2)

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Mature Defender (BUT-578)) : zzzz

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Mature Defender (BUT-578)) : flame sentries are broken

Respawn & Contact

ADMIN: Butlerblock has joined as Bloody Larva (37).

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Ancient Runner (BUT-37)) slashed Angel Hunter

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Ancient Runner (BUT-37)) slashed InsaneRed/(Nathan)

ATTACK: InsaneRed/(Nathan) grabbed Edga274/(Angel Hunter) in Cryo-Thermal Springs (47,65,2).

ATTACK: InsaneRed/(Nathan) has thrown no key/(Angel Hunter) from tile at 49, 61, 2 in area Cryo-Thermal Marshes with the target tile at 52, 56, 2 in area Landing Zone 2 - Ice Fields in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (49,61,2).

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Ancient Runner (BUT-37)) slashed InsaneRed/(Nathan)

ATTACK: Braum ‘Pitbull’ Zimmer shot Butlerblock/(Ancient Runner (BUT-37)) with a machinegun bullet in Landing Zone 2 - Ice Fields (55,58,2).

ATTACK: Adriana Scott shot Butlerblock/(Ancient Runner (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (52,63,2).

ATTACK: Braum ‘Pitbull’ Zimmer shot Butlerblock/(Ancient Runner (BUT-37)) with a machinegun bullet in Landing Zone 2 - Ice Fields (55,58,2).

ATTACK: Adriana Scott shot Butlerblock/(Ancient Runner (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (52,63,2).

ATTACK: Braum ‘Pitbull’ Zimmer shot Butlerblock/(Ancient Runner (BUT-37)) with a machinegun bullet in Landing Zone 2 - Ice Fields (55,58,2).

Final Contact and 2nd Death

ATTACK: Prime Lurker (KO-268-BA) slashed InsaneRed/(Nathan)

ATTACK: InsaneRed/(Nathan) attacked Prime Lurker (KO-268-BA) with telescopic baton (INTENT: HURT) (DAMTYE: BRUTE) in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (49,86,2).

SAY: Prime Lurker (BUT-37): Can you (CKEY: Butlerblock)

ATTACK: Mick McMickinson shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in Cryo-Thermal River (23,109,2).

ATTACK: Mick McMickinson shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in Cryo-Thermal River (23,110,2).

SAY: Prime Lurker (BUT-37): Bait out of cades (CKEY: Butlerblock)

ATTACK: Mick McMickinson shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in Cryo-Thermal River (23,110,2).

HIVEMIND: Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : Ignore her!

SAY: Nathan [Command]: North comms being attacked. (CKEY: InsaneRed) (JOB: Synthetic)

HIVEMIND: Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : Come to comms

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) attacked Angel Hunter with Tail Jab

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) attacked Angel Hunter with Flurry

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) slashed Angel Hunter

ATTACK: The rifle bullet, fired by Fedor ‘Doco’ Vlasov, narrowly missed Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37))

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) attacked Fedor ‘Doco’ Vlasov with Flurry

ATTACK: Fedor ‘Doco’ Vlasov shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in External Mining Aerodrome Caves (41,99,2).

ATTACK: Fedor ‘Doco’ Vlasov shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in External Mining Aerodrome Caves (40,98,2).

ATTACK: Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) slashed Fedor ‘Doco’ Vlasov

ATTACK: Lori Kuznetsov shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (38,91,2).

ATTACK: Blake Stahl shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a shotgun slug in External Mining Aerodrome Caves (34,97,2).

ATTACK: Fedor ‘Doco’ Vlasov shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (38,94,2).

ATTACK: Lori Kuznetsov shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (39,95,2).

ATTACK: Fedor ‘Doco’ Vlasov shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in Cryo-Thermal Marshes (38,95,2).

ATTACK: Fedor ‘Doco’ Vlasov shot Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) with a rifle bullet in External Mining Aerodrome Caves (38,102,2).

Dead Chat Salt

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : that shit

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : is so adis

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : instant fucking flame sentry

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : how is that balanced at all

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : synth is literally walking around placing down instant flame sentries

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : is that not combat synthing?

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : it was flame sentry

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : synth walked over and placed it down instantly cuz of their insane engi skill

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : and then turned it on

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : and since the sentry cant miss, there’s no chance anyone lives it

SAY: Nathan [JTAC]: Mortar. (CKEY: InsaneRed) (JOB: Synthetic)

SAY: Nathan [JTAC]: LONGITUDE : 399, LATITUDE : 286. (CKEY: InsaneRed) (JOB: Synthetic)

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : placing down sentries is just another medium of shooting guns imo

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : also, nuke is such a boring fucking mechanic

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : and it never should have been added

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : they’re just going to ignore any report because “the synth wasnt the one shooting, it was the sentry”

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : or some bullshit like that

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : Synthetics are forbidden from firing any weapons, including direct fire emplacements (M56Ds) and indirect weaponry, such as CAS, the M402 Mortar, and OBs.

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : is a sentry not an indirect weapon?

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : that explains a lot

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : InsaneRed is the synth

ATTACK: Anna ‘Firebitch’ Morozova grabbed InsaneRed/(Nathan) in Landing Zone 2 - Ice Fields (45,26,2).

SAY: DEAD/Butlerblock/(Prime Lurker (BUT-37)) : they overlapped a bit

Steelpoint · March 6, 2024, 4:07am

Added report:needverdict and removed report:pendinglogs

QuickLoad · March 11, 2024, 5:46am

Hello Butlerblock and thanks for your report.

After a very extensive and thorough investigation onto this matter, the council has reviewed all available evidence several times over.

Nathan was accused of using a flame sentry, following Marine pushes and violating combat restrictions. While Synthetics are restricted under general circumstances from using the sentry turret offensively and on the frontline, the evidence available to this report only seemed to show primary avenues leading to and at the communications tower location. When in defense of backline locations(adhereing to combat restrictions), it is not disallowed for a Synthetic to reorient or deploy sentry turrets. If Nathan was offensively moving up a turret and following the front as a combat engineer might, then it would not be allowed - however we did not find any proof of this during our investigation.

Furthermore, while Synthetics are in the spirit to make a minimal effort to return sentry turrets to their owners, if the owner is unresponsive or deceased, there is no ruling against a Synthetic from keeping said turret on their body until it can be given to a more suitable person. It would be bad programming to leave a sentry turret unattended or abandoned, as it is a key asset.

While Nathan did utilize a flamethrower sentry turret during the operation, it was never along the frontline and it was only found engaging backline harassers on two occasions - during the defense of Marines and Marines with a communications tower. Under combat programming restrictions, a sentry turret generally follows the same protocols which a Synthetic follows to conduct combat. Evidence provided did not prove or show that Nathan was using the sentry turret to engage at the frontline, it only showed Nathan utilizing it in defense of the communications tower against backline harassers. Therefore, this report is denied.

We would like to thank the moderator team for their efforts in pulling logs. Have a good day everyone!

QuickLoad · March 11, 2024, 5:47am

Added report:denied and removed report:needverdict

harryob · March 31, 2024, 12:47pm

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