Comms needs a marine buff (if the FOB rework is to proceed)

Development Ideaguys
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Title. I’ll say it again. If this FOB rework is going to continue along, and it seems likely to, then comms is a big glaring issue that needs to be addressed.

What is the issue? Well it’s simple. Because transformer is a new objective for marines to defend, now fobbits are stretched even more thin then usual. As a result, if marines are pushed back to FOB, they’re essentially forced to guard both comms AND the transformer now, which will make protecting the FOB a lot harder for marines and will more often then not force early evacuations. A longer portion of the round will be hijack, which is a feature most people dislike.

But you may say, “just send a few marines to comms and let them call over the marines”. Well I say, “what about transformer”. Let’s say marines rush over to comms to recapture it. Well xenos can just take transformer. And vice versa. Xenos will be rewarded heavily even if they take one point (that being transformer or comms), while marines are forced to somehow defend BOTH or suffer consequences if they lose one of them.

Another severe issue with comms is now that cade availability has been nerfed significantly, marines will have a harder time fortifying comms to prevent queen and tier 3s from steamrolling comms.

You might say, “hurrr durr just push the queen!”

Here’s my response.

Queen Screech

Queen screech has been a glaring issue since this game existed. One big advantage of cades is they protected marines from getting dragged or slashed at by xenomorphs (though boiler can still attack marines who are behind cades). Runners dragging during queen screech is an egregious issue in particular that has PRACTICALLY ZERO COUNTERPLAY. Let’s say comms is taken and queen and hivelords rush over to weed up comms. Then marines push but guess what? Queen screeches, tier 3s kill marines, and runners drag marines into the hive. Xenos have all the tolls they can to fortify comms, but marines don’t. Keep in mind, marines area also forced to focus themselves on protecting the transformer as well.

In short, comms is even more difficult for marines to SECURE now that they have to worry about transformer and a lack of cades as well. Cades acted as a buffer to give marines times to rally up at comms and to repel any attack.

Oh and I forgot to mention, you have to secure generators as well to keep the comms apc running. So that is a THIRD OBJECTIVE that marines need to worry about, which just spreads themselves very thin.

So how do you go about fixing the problem with comms in the FOB rework?

If this FOB rework is to continue, which it likely will, then I would do two following things.

Make it so only tier 3s can break the comms machine and the apc. Give comms a super apc or encase it in glass protection that only tier 3s and queen and king can break. This would help make comms more of a challenge. Given the lack of cades in the FOB rework, it’s a lot easier for a runner to rush comms and break a lot of stuff. Comms is crucial to marine organization, so comms should be harder to take.

Give comms gauss turrets that is powered by the transformer. Also maybe place some undissolvable crate that has a few stacks of metal. This is the second idea. Maybe not as strong as the FOB turrets, but make it so that xenos have to take the transformer FIRST and THEN take comms. I think that would make comms a fun stepping stone that xenos have to work towards instead of just being able to rush comms while marines are focused on transformer or vice versa. Xenos take transformer, then the gauss turrets turn off and now they can take comms, but they have to go through some cades first. This would make comms fun to take and hold again, instead of being super easy for xenos like it was during the FOB siege.

The vast majority of rounds in the FOB pr was that xenos would push back marines and would easily take comms and get larva surge or even king if marines were brave enough to not evac. But most rounds resulted in early xeno majors.

And I am a xeno main myself. Both sides should be strong, fun to play, and fun to fight against. This FOB rework nerfed marines too hard.

I was vocal about being against the old FOB siege. And I think this game is good and fun, but I think the FOB rework was poorly executed and some fundamental aspects need to be overhauled if we are to get a fun FOB rework.

Edit: Let me stress. Although most of us disagree with the FOB rework, be nice. Never resort to harassing. Everyone makes mistakes.

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crazy idea………… what if you put the marines that were normally on fob… on comms?! since they have to guard the transformer surely they can spare a few extra marines that were normally afk in the lz at comms…

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Most marines will already be focused defending the transformer, so comms is much easier for xenos to take. And if marines rush to comms, they can just rush to transformer.

Forcing marines to be at two places at once while xenos need to only be on one (the queen) is inherently disadvantageous towards marines, as marines will be spreading their forces thin and xenos not.

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You shouldn’t really need to defend the transformer too much. Only T3s, Carrier, Queen and King can wreck it. And it takes like 30 solid seconds to do so as well. You would only really need like 2-3 dudes all in all for both comms and the transformer.

And if the queen or some T3s try to sneak kill any of these, you can just divert your front for easy kills on them because they need to either tunnel out, or go some super long way around to not be noticed by the front.

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Literally just not true

You dont need to defend FOB at all

Before the rework you needed troops on FOB and comms.

After the rework you still just need troops on two locations- The transformer and comms.

I don’t understand why you later argue that its bad for marines to defend two locations when thats literally how it’s been for the past half decade???

This rework’s intention was to make FOB invincible on it’s own and force marines to rely on the transformer. Other criticisms aside, it does accomplish this point pretty well.

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Also fun fact for you people who just keep saying “move the marines around” marines as soon as they step out of FOB generally start going off to do fuck all. Its like once they are away from fob buddy system goes to shit and people completely forget orders. I agree with making it a tier 3 breaking apcs and comms change if it does happen, but maybe add in a semi damaged state for lower casts where it has a 25% chance to scramble a comms message and to damage the comms further requires a tier 3.

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when the fob is almost literally invincible, I am not sure why the guys guarding fob are not guarding the transformer. Even if it dies, you have 10 minutes to retake it thanks to aux power shanagans. And even if that dies, high/med pop you still have half of a megafob. Only a T3/queen can hit the transformer so I have only seen it taken when xenos finally take the map: not from random backliners.

You call it a nerf but since bravo can fuck off from fob and go support comms/transformer/frontline I wouldnt be surprised if marines are winning more than usual.

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Correct.

Correct.

Correct.

Correct.

Correct.

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Static comms sucks and they sucked from the day stan albatross into/reintroduced them, comms could be used for 2 hour mark nuke/king but portacomms needs to make a comeback.

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When in the hell did two or three marines on any round defend comms, or a point that was significantly important? The answer is never. Especially with a queen screech. I know i’ve tried it as we all have at one point or another as a marine in our various rounds at times few and far between. The dude gave some legit ideas to fix this problem and considerable amount of players have voiced their concernts with the re-work. Listen to us and we can totally come up with a good idea. Saying well just send AFK marines there… THERE AFK. Thats a stupid take. Legit come work together with us and come up with some legit ideas to make it to where the fob rework that is a good idea but it’s been a very, very bad outcome that both sides of players don’t really like but do have some good ideas to fix.

My idea to fix this is to get rid of static comms. MAKE it to where the Almeyer has the links supported on the ship to control planet based comms. OR actually revitalize the FTL’s for their original purpose. Their backpacks can have a satelite uplink to the Almeyer. To where if they are active in your squad your entire squad has the comms link. If any of them go down, give command the chance to switch the link to somone else in the squad similiar to an SL role. THERE is a lot of really creative things we can do to fix comms and come up with cool ways to make it a fun game. Think out of the box sometimes.

On low pop you don’t have that choice tho. Bravo has 5-8 marines at best in low pop often. It’s not just simple as sending two or four marines to a point and defend when he raised the actual problem with that. The queen screech knocking those marines off the cades where they are either at comms or transformer. He raised the actual issue you deal with when defending with minimal numbers.

Bravo doesn’t have to worry about the fob. Which is cool, but xenos rush the transformer and comms both sometimes. Thats the problem and bravo doesn’t have the numbers to legit defend it.

The ideas some of us propose to fix it is lets legit make it to where marines haul their gear with them. ONE example to possibly fix transformer issue is to bring their own generators down with them. They set up the generators at the fob they power the grid to transformers. Make it a compuer link or something creative like a portable laptop. If that gets destroyed transformer loses the link from the power and has 5 minutes to get it back up and make it to where you fix the laptop like an apc.

Another possiblity of a fix is to plainly get rid of static comms. I stated one example above but, that there are multiple ways to do this. But name a military force that doesn’t bring its’ own gear to set up shop for an engagement in any game, or real life. They don’t.

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There’s a misconception here: The marines on comms are not intended to fully defend it by themselves.

Their job is to stop lone backliners from solo killing comms and forcing a significant push from xenos to take it out. When that happens, it’s their job to scream for help and slow down the xeno assault so command can redirect marines to converge and wipe the xenos at comms with full force.

It works with considerable success whenever xenos fail to degrade the frontline sufficiently before YOLOing comms- It’s easy to pincer the xenos and punish them for it.

Not an issue- Assuming that only bravo squad is available to deal with a hive rush on transformer/comms is a bad assumption to make, given if the xenos expend that much power then any competent CIC will withdraw troops from the frontline to crush and pincer the xenos attacking comms or the transformer. If CIC fails to do so, then marines got beaten fair and square, not due to some mechanical bias.

Issue with these kinds of ‘portable’ objectives is that you can just sit them at FOB and thus they become untouchable until AFTER the marines are effectively collapsing.

For this suggestion specifically, it has a lot of holes in the logic-
The transformer powers the FOB defences, which are designed to make FOB invincible. Any xenomorph attempting to invade FOB will basically die instantly.

By making the transformer invincible until the laptop is destroyed, the primary objective of xenomorphs is now the laptop- Which is in FOB, because it’s a portable objective you can place anywhere.

Therefore, I attack FOB.
Problem, FOB is protected by defences that instakill me.
How do I disable the defences?
By disabling the transformer.
Which requires me to disable the laptop.
Which requires me to attack FOB.
Which is protected by defences that instakill me.

It’s a catch 22 situation, so you’ve basically made it impossible for marines to actually lose whatsoever. Every round is now a guaranteed marine major.

Re: porta-comms

A lot of people liked portable comms. Now, personally I could swing either way- I’m fine with either because my enjoyment of the game didn’t really change before, during and after portacomms.

However, it’s obvious the maintainers would rather comms be an active objective to fight over, something that literally isn’t possible with portable comms- For instance, if you axed portable comms and just made marines have comms 24/7 literally nothing would change because that’s what it effectively did.

I just can’t see portable comms ever returning, it’s honestly just a bloat mechanic from a gameplay perspective. Either have comms be an objective, as is the status quo (and thus necessitate it being static), or have it be permanently on for marines.

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Make comms a secondary objective that needs to be up to relay for supply drops or Intel or something and then give radio packs an eight tile local comms range that goes up to the ship, alongside still allowing calls for urgent things and sovl. Bring FTL back to its RTO roots by asking them to scatter amongst the force to maintain comms.

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On low pop tho there in lies the problem you don’t have enough marines to actually do much. If your dealign with 10-13 xenos and you have 6 marines guarding an area. there is no way your defending a spot for a long time like comms or transformer. Again, we got the problems with comms, it should just be like my idea was. Almeyer has the uplink, make FTL as long as they are alive the uplink source to the squads.

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Sadly, the game is not balanced around low pop.

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It doesn’t have to be. But, the rework gives you zero chance to even play or bother during low pop, without the re-work you had a chance. Thats the point.

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you do have to defend fob still, it’s where new marines arrive, wounded marines are offloaded, ammo, mortar, supplies, etc are stored, these are all sensitive and need guarding just as much as transformer and comms

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Absolutely correct, yes. The FOB is the most important location, secondary to the transformer. This is why FOB is given literal invincibility defences that instakill T1s and grief any T3 that lacks explosive res, and the transformer and comms are not.

FOB has:
2 Mega-sentries which literally shred everything that comes close with IFF. Not a single xeno can stand up to these.

1 Missile-sentry which has actual aimbot + wallhack and griefs everyone who even dares wander within sight range of FOB due to the massive sensor posts.

Invincible fences which dont even let you in the first place.

Now, here’s the real question. Can FOB solo defend against the entire hive with just these defences?

The answer is yes. Yes, it absolutely could. It’s not even a question- These defences are absurdly strong, and if you add in the starting OP 4x LZ turrets with screenwide range, you don’t even need to defend FOB while it’s being set up.

Okay. So if FOB is invincible on it’s own, WHY would you station even a single gasmask bravo PVT on it? What’re they gonna do? They are so insignificant that you wouldn’t make the FOB safer in any meaningful capacity.

No, it doesn’t.
FOB is, to put it frankly- Invincible. Anyone inside while the transformer is on is safe. They aren’t going to die even if they’re the only person inside.

The same is not true of the transformer or comms. The transformer is the xenomorph win condition- They literally can’t win without taking out the transformer first unless they do a funny Normandy hijack (upon which they will die horribly shipside).
The transformer is fragile. It has no innate defences. It requires humans to man and defend.
The same is true of comms. FOB meanwhile, is fully automated and once set up, does not require anyone.

If xenos are winning, no one should be hugging FOB. Every single soul should be around the transformer, skirmishing around it and doing everything they can to take it back.

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we realy need the queen rework, thwompa poke the queen rework with a stick pls pls, it is just sutch a setback in what could the gameplay be :smiling_face_with_tear:

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