Gachiweeb - Player Report: Ordorak Oathbreaker, Njila’Ost Ktal’t, Spirit of the WL
What’s your BYOND key?
Gachiweeb
Round ID:
17751
Your character name:
Warrior DP-433
Accused BYOND key:
Ordosian, Unknown
Accused character name:
Ordorak Oathbreaker, Njila’Ost Ktal’t
What rule(s) were broken?:
Spirit of the WL
Description of the incident:
The whole reason I am making this report is that even though what those two preds did may be within rules strictly speaking I feel like it’s overstepping them and acts against the whole spirit of the whitelist.
All this happened after 2 preds got capped by xenos.
Theres 3 moments that I captured but there might have been more that I didn’t see.
First interaction I had was 2,3 screens away from the hive after we captured 2 preds. A Xeno mentioned someone breaking in from the lake or north part of the hive, so me and a couple of runners went there. Ordo proceeded to fight us, while cloaked killing some of us.
While this situation could be within rules to use all means necessary to kill an Abom the Abomb was not even born yet and we were far from the hive. Using the tools that you would use on a dishonorable target just on Xenos protecting their territory and later on even abandoning the idea to push into hive just comes off as excessive. You can easily LPC stun, go another way, cloak to sneak into the hive or fight us normally instead of what he did.
Second situation i saw Njila’Ost Ktal’t and Ordorak teaming up to kill prime warrior that i think was set on fire by them west of nexus and after that Njila using plasma casters killing xenos resisting out of fire and overall chasing them.
During all this aboms were in central nexus fighting the marines and those two preds chose to use all their tools to engage xenos far from them again ignoring other options to deal with the situation as just cloaking and ignoring them to deal with aboms or stunning them and repositioning again i think this is poor usage of the tools the whitelist gives you and acting in bad faith as the tools meant to deal with the running aboms are instead used to just kill xenos left and right.
The last thing i recorded was Ordorak fighting south of LZ 2 again using all his tools on regular xenos instead of going after the two aboms that were in LZ 1 that is almost on the other side of the map. If those xenos were chasing him and hindering him all he needed to do was cloak and just walk away, heal and go deal with aboms.
In all those videos i find them using their tools to be excessive and unnecessary. Spirit of the whitelist rule was put in for a reason, and if creation of an abom is enough to throw away all common sense while engaging xenos without aboms being anywhere near them why even have that rule.
To me this just shows that capturing a pred is just not worth the hassle as any pred can just decide that no matter where i am, he can just go ham throw away all the rules that bound him previously and just kill me.
Compare that to other actions of preds during previous abom rounds or even in this one where they used their tools carefully, and with common sense it’s the dramatic difference in their behaviour.
In the end Ordorak racked up i think around 17 kills and NONE of them were the abom.
excessive how? i believe all the clips you showed fall under the xenos protecting the abominations, even if the abomination in question is not on the screen.
as far as i can remember, the warrior on the second clip was initially protecting the abomination(which i attacked) and then he chased me all the way down from north side of the nexus and through the mini-jungle section to the west, with a bunch of other xenos i set on fire with my plasma pistol and killed(third clip)
i believe that spirit of the wl exists to prevent outright griefing of players by predators because “we’re antagonists”
in this case, the hive has captured not one, but two predators. and the predators trying to get into the hive to prevent the abomination from being born, while xenos are protecting it. please explain how this falls under “spirit of the WL” clause?
I’m glad you asked.
On the old forum I’ve an old report concerning the spirit of the whitelist.
In there I have two quotes, one from an old council member and another from the reported player.
And part of this quoute i find perfectly describes the rule how I see it.
“the effect of ‘spirit of the WL’ or ‘don’t be a dick’ works. If they’re a dick? They lose the WL. Sure preds COULD go around HPC’ing anything that attacks them first, but as we’ve seen that quickly ends in them losing the WL”
here is the link to the old report.
What i see here is a similar issue which is:
Just becouse you can doesn’t mean you should.
And as i said at the start of the report i myself thought you both could deal with those xenos in better ways or rather more fair ways.
the old report being… a predator using all his tools to kill a lone xeno? how’s this similar to xenos protecting an abomination?
yeah? what’s your point? i never said that we should HPC anyone in any case when it’s allowed
fair ways? the fair ways being to fight a horde of xenos? you, as a longstanding xeno player, perfectly know that a big group of xenos can easily kill a predator in 90% of situations, especially when a warrior is present.
running away is not an option as we had to lessen the amount of xenos since we literally couldn’t come anywhere close to the abominations. i believe the amount of xenos that were present at the time were around 35-40, and i see no reason to go easy on the xenos when they are chasing you all the way through half of the map
Just to start this off, 17 kills weren’t from all killing Xenos. I hunted throughout the round before we even had Abominations.
We had two abominations be born during this round. I did deploy my full gear to deal with the hive. Yes, the abominations were not present in some of these cases. The reason? Because Abominations were quite literally staying next to the Queen and the other xenos were protecting them and chasing us around the map.
If I cloak and run away to heal. I will end up in the same situation. The same xenos chasing me and causing me to run away to recover. So yes, the abominations may have not been present in those cases, but it was due to me trying to engage the abominations that those Xenos chased me.
LPC does not stun Xenos. It’s the MPC which takes up more charge and is slower, and we do not have recharge on the colony outside of using APCs. Every way to the hive was guarded and blockaded with thick resin walls, sticky resin etc. And inside close spaces in which predators can be swarmed in easily. I am not sure what you want me to do in that situation.
And regardless if the abomination is born or not. There were two captured predators in the hive that were about to burst which we can not allow, therefore allowing us the use of dishonourable weaponry.
I tried sneaking into the hive previously but it is literally impossible with the amount of resin doors and walls you had. Thinning out the numbers was the best possible outcome.
I don’t think you understand how difficult it is to attack abominations which can decloak you in the middle of Xenos. HPC is the only thing that can stun the abominations but that doesn’t last long, especially when there is an entire hive protecting the two abominations. The tools are given to deal with any dishonourable prey. Including xenos that protect the abominations. So in this case, the hive.
running away is not an option as we had to lessen the amount of xenos since we literally couldn’t come anywhere close to the abominations. i believe the amount of xenos that were present at the time were around 35-40, and i see no reason to go easy on the xenos when they are chasing you all the way through half of the map
At most you were fighting 3,4 xenos majority being T1s i wouldn’t call that a horde
I tried sneaking into the hive previously but it is literally impossible with the amount of resin doors and walls you had. Thinning out the numbers was the best possible outcome.
i don’t find any issue with you using all the tools you have on hives actively protecting and being near aboms.
What i find issue with is that as you both now admitted you decided to thin out the numbers of xenos even when they were not close to the abom.
So you used tools meant to be used on dishonorable targets on xenos who under normal circumstances would be honorable, JUST because abom was SOMEWHERE on the map.
That is what I think is excessive use of your tools.
As when i personally took part in other rounds were aboms were on the map.
Preds used tools and weapons meant to deal with aboms ONLY near aboms or to get to them.
When i or other xenos engaged them with no abom around us, they would fight us normally or just run away both of these options i find much much more sensible than what both of you did this round.
You do know that we can use dishonourable weapons on targets that engage us without due cause? So even if there were no abominations. If the Xenos chased the predator and engaged it themselves, they could be killed via dishonourable weapons. However, in this case, there was abominations which makes any prey defending it, dishonourable.
But we do not usually use that clause to make engagements fair. In this case, we had a mission. Kill the Abominations. Which the xeno hive was protecting. You can’t expect us to just kill the abominations when it is literally impossible with the amount of Xenos around.
Heya!
So I’m just going to say: This is a player report, Give your side of the story and give any witness statements/useful information. This isnt the place to discuss, so dont do that. Just give the information and wait for the council to make a decision.
Anyways I was playing xeno in this round and have some useful info.
IIRC xenos were fighting at least Ordosian even before the predators were captured, and we were being kinda aggressive chasing them around. This did continue throughout the round and even during the hive defence usually there would be around 1-2 screens worth of chasing while the predators were trying to disengage.
I dont know if the amount of xenos hunting the preds was enough to be considered a “Hive Offensive” or anything like that since I’m not a scholar on honor code. But there was 100% multiple xenos chasing after wounded preds basically the entire round, that being pre and post captured preds/abominations.
Spirit of the whitelist clause is not for situations like this, and the Vice Host was watching the entire time, and has determined no rules or WL guidelines were broken.