Slugs should be buffed to the state they were in the past which is stunning humans from range, otherwise they are damn useless in HvH. Hell, even add this to HvX too.
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Imo it is quite straight forward.
Limit maximum damage that can be taken to 150 or so and make it so you cannot take more damage after death past this value.
Make it not possible to loot or equip enemy uniforms, armors (no spy stuff)
Change some values on armors, so that they are balanced relative to ballistic damage instead of melee.
Limit the availability of scopes, so that they are not spammed.
Make main enemy base immune to OB or fire missions. Introduce some âbunkersâ or hardpoints that are protected from CAS and mortar. (One clan flatten out an entire outpost with the mortar), but not immune to OB for example. This works similarly to pylons, except it could be a flag instead or some kind of mounted radio that gives players a boost.
Make sure both factions have counterparts of some kind, yet also faction specific features. (For example heavier UPP bullets, armor and firepower, yet slower and bulkier VS UA faster higher AP value rounds and faster armor, yet more brittle and squishy, UPP heavy artillery saturation strike vs marines precise orbital strike)
And the other thing is people are used to playing XvH. They will simply need to adapt to playing HvH, which requires a completely different set of strategies and loadouts.
HvH can be less dynamic but way more intense. Who shoots first and has the better positioning is the one that is going to win. Shotgun buckshot will need an upgrade in accuracy, less spread and range, slugs as well in damage and impact. Grenades will be necessary for breaching defenses or going around corners.
Use of dark areas and environmental lighting is also something to consider. It may be wise to limit the amount of totally dark areas to limit the amount of blind combat in the dark.
Choke points should not be more distant than 6 squares for example.
Other than that, not many changes are needed.
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Quite a lot of what you have commented on has already been done for the game mode.
Mobs stop taking damage when they die, your ability to strip the enemy is curtailed while they are dead, you canât wear the enemy uniforms, all armor values in the game have been re balanced for the game mode (USCM and UPP), scopes donât work, binoculars are nerfed, OB is disabled, CAS is disabled. Darkness is disabled, but flares are useful to make target identification faster.
Mortar is mostly untouched, however more warning is given before a mortar lands, explosive rounds donât stun you anymore so you can still escape assuming you donât get killed. However the recent mortar changes mean the FOB is generally not being shelled until the FOB siege occurs.
I think a lot of issues people are having with the game mode just come down to a lack of experience with this kind of game mode. If we play it more, people will start to understand its nuances.
4 Likes
If that is the case then I believe most things have been accounted for. Thereâs two other things that come to mind.
We should enable both OB and CAS for both factions.
The use of something like the JIMA flag, or a plantet radio station mob, functionally the same as Xeno pylons, would work as a limiting factor against Mortar and CAS, wherever the teams decide to set up outposts. A barrier needs to be in place, for example a fog or a lockdown, that allows each side to build these outposts, while preventing them from moving into âneutralâ ground during the staging phase. An interesting idea would be to also put the comms towers on each side, for the opposing side to take out each otherâs communication lines.
The OB should be enabled for the marine side, yet limited to 1 shot, but no more than two, where the enemy main base should be unable to be hit by OB. The UPP also needs their own equivalent to the OB, something like a âHeavy Artilery barrageâ or âBallistic Missile strikeâ functionally the same. This allows roles such as GP, or command to still fulfill an important aspect of their roles too, while minimizing negative impact on the round.
Additionally, we need to create the appropriate infrastructure for UPP or opposing factions as well.
The âJoin the Xenosâ button, should read âJoin OPFORâ and the list of available roles should show up, the same way when you click on join the USCM. This includes having an UPP ship or CLF bunker, or so, where you can normally spawn and everything is accounted for (cryo, req, medical, engi, command, telecomms, etc).
Expanding infrastructure provided to OPFOR to match the one that USCM already has would be a good start. Side objectives, such as intel points, communication towers, colony power, etc, could also be utilized to have an impact on the round to make the action more dynamic or interesting.
I think that expanding the game mode among these lines would make it more interesting to play, than just who shoots first. Instead of cutting features, I would advocate limiting or restricting them to a certain degree. Instead of removing scopes entirely, limit them in number or in effectiveness. The effect of an explosion could still stun but less, perhaps even blur the vision and apply slowdown like shellshock in COD or so. I would suggest that instead of cutting features, adapt them instead to a dynamic vision for the game.
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I we did add most of this few months ago already so I am just gonna try to summarize all the changes somewhat in order that you encounter them when playing the gamemode.
- in lobby you have option to set up character and assign it to UPP slots, set preference to round start joining as UPP same as with marine roles and round start join from UPP cryo after that there is join as UPP button
- UPP have their own ship where you spawn at
- UPP vendors have been balanced to be similar to USCM ones
- USCM specs receive b18 kits, UPP has the machineguners
- UPP ship has working req their own req elevator included and working squad drops
- UPP received working overwatch and squads (missing UPP squad comms to be added in future)
- UPP have their own DS, no CAS for either side at the moment, I would require nonlethal ammo for both side cas and the AA guns to be finished for FOB protection
- both sides have LZ inserts with premade cades and some claymores and surgery tables
- there is 5 minute ceasefire at the start that prevents you from most forms of harm during it, with RP expectations mean to prevent the rest (it kinda turns you into synth in terms of restrictions)
- both sides have similar armor values
- ammo received major re-balance to shift it more to CQC combat all ammo except for buck and slug and somewhat pistol ammo have their accuracy decreased by a LOT, normal ammo has accuracy range reduced to on screen AP ammo has it reduced to 4 tiles with sharp acc dropoff past that range
- flame damage is reduced by a lot, same with explosions and explosions blind , throw you away and slow you but do not stun
- all splints are replaced with nanosplint, IB is removed
- dead can not take any harm, nor c4ed or striped and can not be moved by enemy faction except for explosions
- defibs work with armor on, so you can heal enemy faction
- mortar shells have flashing laser before impact, similar to direct cas strikes
- there is automated roundend when there is less then five? (I do not remember what value I put there) members of one faction that are not restring/dead and are not cuffed that triggers round end messages and roundend ceasefire .
I think that should be all future plans would be nonlethal cas, further tweeks to some guns, removal of most but few attachments as they are power creeped to hell with their accuracy values even tho that on HvX all guns but few just have 120% hitchance and possibly automated jobslot opening, but that one is hard and hella timeconsuming and near impossible to balance without huge time investment and currently I do not have time to play let alone code, in few months⌠or if some contribeor possibly you can learn to code it is not hard and CM is good place to start
But eh I will not be able to help you as I am discord banned atm.
Generally the combat allows for both range and cqc combat, and prolongs the time it takes to kill enough for you to have option to disengage or use some other tools rather then who shoots first wins, making MORE guns viable then on HvX and more nades and other tools that are useless on HvX are decent on current HvH with nothing with exception of SG being really that worse (I did nerf most of the marine supersnowflake guns as XM MOU M2C but they are still decent).
So I would say so far majority of your issues that you had with HvH have been addressed so try to go and give it a try when given the option. compared to before steel as event runner only relay has to do usual admin duties and manage amount of open slots as far as I am aware, compared to past HvH events when several admins were needed just to create the faction bases and spawn ERTs/free mobs for the opposing faction and spawn supplies for them wile trying to maintain some semblance of order to it, all the changes hopeful allow for more âeventâ stuff do be done during the events with admins having more free time to do stuff as civilians and RP additions, but that is up to them not me how they run the event
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I played the last event and had a lot of fun. The only part of the event I had a problem with was the UPP prep room. The room seemed too small for the number of people at the event. The hoards of players all waking up, all rushing to the vendors within the prep room, the ungodly amount of gear, both wanted and discarded, had begun to pile up. And I couldnât really complain that someone had seemingly stolen my pouches. I was too busy looking for a distinction between items with near-identical names and visual designs.
I was a part of the winning factions in both rounds. In the first round, I diligently watched the FOB flank and wasnât met with any probe or resistance. The round ended shortly after the ceasefire. In the second round, I wasnât looking to be about that life again and walked directly into the enemy dropship. I felt confident doing it because I had binocs, and they had no defenders. After permaâing two enemies on their dropship (and an allied POW, very sorry still) I realized that there really was no point in holding your FOB, or any other location. It felt as if I shouldâve joined the rolling kill ball in order to live longer in the end. I mustâve been looking to be the guy unfreezing everyone in freeze tag or something
Like I said at the start though, I thought everything was fun, and the UPP ship was very cool (I actually got lost pre-drop and looked around a bit.) Iâll definitely be attempting to join this upcoming one too.
3 Likes
UPP need an SEBB equivalent or something, marines just throw one, youâre stunned for nearly 10 seconds or so, and they can throw another one, while UPP have no SEBB equivalent and so canât just stun marines.
(i died to SEBB as UPP i am coping)
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I think these rounds suffer a lot because of the numbers being very imbalanced. The marines will usually have a 10-20 person advantage which is pretty hard for the UPP to overcome regardless of any sort of weapon/game balance prespective. Marine weapons seem as though theyâre more accurate than the UPP ones but itâs hard to tell objectively. I think itâs weird that UPP riflemen can get 2 grenades using 2/3 of their points but marine riflemen get 3
Remove MOU on hvh
add sniper specs on both side
the upp spec machine gun should 100% be more accurate OR deal more damage as itâs too weak compared to sg
marines shouldnât get g2 nades
The condition Iâd be interested in seeing a introduction of a USCM and UPP sniper is if its mechanics are as follows.
- Sniper functions akin to the standard USCM sniper
- The sniper gains most of its damage and AP via the laser-designation mode.
- The laser designation timer is increased by several seconds, to make it easier for someone to notice and take cover
- The damage is set so a full health Marine/Trooper can survive one shot barely, but two shots will put them into deep crit (around 80 to 100 damage).
My thought process is the Sniper would excel in area denial in open enviroments, but the warning time from the laser is enough to give you a chance to return to cover, so it feels less hopeless.
Xenos have the advantage of being able to move quickly and no permanent injuries if they tank the shot. Humans donât have those advantages
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i assume if peoples feedback on blood loss gets accepted this will be even easier to implement, i just went into pain bloodloss crit for half an hour from a couple PKM bullets and i was wearing b18, regarding permanent injuries
Not sure how anyone had blood loss issues- I took a shitload of rounds with Light and then B17 the next round and bandaged all my wounds and scarfed an MRE once I ran out of bandages. Are you stacking IB on six limbs?
Otherwise, yeah, pop advantage is ridiculous. Itâd be nice to have some sort of mechanic to curb it- auto balance?
Sniper spec with like a 5 second visible charge up will never get any hits, like, ever unless they target someone in a group and their friends shuffle the shit out of them. What would be the point of that?
The MOU53 is still âol reliable. With fletchette and the forced fire cooldown, you actually can hit people with spriteclick. Itâs nice! Certainly felt like SEBBS were kinda nuts, I saw someone take them two rounds in a row.
Has the Type73 been changed at all? I want to main my peashooter on UPP side⌠didnât get to play them at all cuz I had to go to work, and I didnât realize Spec was literally just heavy armor. Itâs a neat idea but I think the class name ought to be changed to Breacher or something because thereâs no âweaponâ for weapons spec.
So that you donât die from offscreen in the most unfair way possible. Mortar doesnât get any kills either, unless you pay no attention to anything, or were forced to stay at one spot/run trough impact tile.
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Allow MPs for both sides to deploy to handle POWs and stop warcrimes and stuff
The first round of 19.04.2025 was very fine. Played as a Political Commisar and even RPed with a captured combat correspondent. The gripe I have is that PC starts boxed in, in his office, by an equipment vendor and his desk, requiring to get over it. Also, apprently, random high-ranking marines, even SLs I think, can access his office, which is unusual for a CL counterpart.
Didnât get to play another round as UPP, because of a random character slot swap bug. A pity.
Overall, enjoyed it a lot, from RP perspective.
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- UPP seemed to have a general lack of medics, but that might be coincidental.
- Not sure why AP ammo is commonly available, people already become combat ineffective after taking a few shots, is there really a desperate need to ignore armor?
- UPP prep room is a disaster, everyone crowding around a handful of vendors, countless items discarded and vended from the same spot, each role or squad needs a separate prep.
- It might be fashionably immersive to have all the UPP role names Russian-themed, but for usability half of them donât actually indicate what they do.
- Identifying friend from foe can occasionally be a little difficult, while the armors are clearly colored (teal vs. dark green), helmet accessories muddle it up. Also UPP squads have no visual distinction besides specific roles having HUD elements.
- IFF on UPP dropship mounted M56Ds means they canât be used against marines. Not sure if this is the case with other IFF gear.
- I get that you donât want people staring through their binos half the round, but the alternative is blindly walking into kill zones because they have no way to scout out where theyâre going.
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AP has heavily decreased accuracy past few tiles, it is not just normal ammo +.
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During the first event, I used the carbine, which served me well inside the dropship. During this second event, I wanted to mess around, so I decided to use the NP92 pistol. It felt like I was lasering a guy with how accurately I was beaming him five or six tiles away. I nearly killed him with a single mag, but I was gradually overwhelmed by the enemy marines within FOB/Comms. Kinda just paced out the 3 grenades I got from my packet to try to slow them down. I think a lot of players may be running out to brawl, consequences be damned, and coin-flipping their lives on the first engagement. With stuff like IB being removed for the event and the ceasefire allowing either side to trade POWs (Have we managed this yet?) it seems shortsighted to attempt to insta win.
Iâm not saying anything specifically is happening because I was way too locked into shouting the superior UPP warcry, and like last time I had fun, and donât really mind the double loss this time.
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A SG marine tanked my fucking JRA-12 Handheld Anti-Tank Grenade Launcher to the face. No limbs no broken bones, just half HP. Just how much did you nerf the UPP holyshit.
Also no offense but revert the accuracy bullshit, Iâve placed a whole UPP SMG mag into a marine and 70% of the bullets missed.
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