This is a draft. I made it in 5 minutes. Please tell me if there are any glaring plot holes in this conceptually.
If you are going to say some shit like “THIS IS GOING TO BE IMPOSSIBLE!!! NO CADES!!!” you are getting fed to a woodchipper.
Thanks.
8 Likes
dead by daylight survivors its over 
If mapping becomes a issue, the safehouses could have their entrance be a set of ladders or stairs to an off-map area, maybe there can be a special system where if a xeno enters a safehouse (if survs fail to secure it) then when they climb down the stairs they are teleported to one of several hidden tunnels that are inside the safehouse so they can safely exit to attack the survivors.
Of course when multiz is implemented, mapping will be less of a issue, you could make the safehouse an actual underground bunker, or above ground area, etc, etc.
2 Likes
Honestly pretty good, I like the equipment failures, but maybe make them happen sooner for certain maps. In some, it’d be stupid easy to reach the safe room like 624 or Big Red.
A quick concern, the reason it’s adrenaline is because survivors group up and are dangerous to fight (because of low xeno numbers fighting them). Xeno vs group pvp is amazing, because of how much both sides risk. It’s pretty core to how the role plays and is what makes rushing things fun IMO - people only hate on it because they die and death should never be a consideration in surv vs survhunter pvp unless it’s of the enemy and you won.
That’s why it’s good practice.
Encouraging them to split up for faster clears may just make it an RNG check into win, or a loss with a minimally risky fight (1v1 with a xeno!). Or, kill 1 guy and the rest escape within 5 minutes (before you can evo into non-drone t1s) which will be frustrating (a good equivalent example would be trijent elevator - there is no way to get there faster then survs can, so they can just Rwall it off and sit there for ages. Altho honestly, safehouse will still be less frustrating then fighting trijent elevator or molotovs because at least you don’t have to wait lmao. )
- Higher challenge for both sides = More adrenaline
- Higher risk for both sides = More adrenaline
- Higher action = More adrenaline
Some questions on how you intend it to play -
How far do survivors need to roam?
Will safehouse be in generally dangerous parts of the map? (ie: eta, lambda, mining?)
How fast should getting to the safehouse be? (minimum time? maximum time?)
Further, how fast should you get the fuel tank? (what rng roll, how many rng checks can be done quickly?)
How dangerous should the fights be?
The saferoom proposal itself with the survivor debuff doesnt make much sense. Should survivors rush to seal themselves off from xenos? Should sealing the room be the last resort? What if a xeno gets locked in one of these and all survivors die, leaving a whole xeno out of the game permanently, or until marines come and unseal it? Is the skill nerf permanent, making all survivors have 0 skills? - This is the first set of questions I personally have.
Now onto more complex stuff.
How will nightmare inserts interact with this, for example PMC insert on Solaris? Will they get adrenaline crash as well? Will adrenaline crash instead just remove the skills that arent part of their civilian\normal counterpart?
How will CLF survivors interact with this? For now the hostile survivor rework is not even test merged, so how will solo CLF be taken care of in this? Obviously the CLF survivor has to either surrender to USCM once they open the seal or immediatly fire on them, risking their fellow survivors. We also have to ask if adrenaline crash will impact people outside of the saferoom? If not then this just makes the problem of “Solo CLF lockerhiding to frag 2 PVTs and then dying” even worse, as CLF survivor loses any and all point in helping other survivors. If yes then someone might start griefing their fellow survivors by locking themselves off alone or with one other person, while leaving the others dying without skills or room for escape.
Another obvious point is to make sure to tell mappers to make these areas either in undefendable, for xenos, points or entirely outside of the range where a queen can hive. We already have enough scout cloak hives on Chance’s, no need for saferoom hives.
And last thing I wish to address - will survivors be able to unseal themselves past a certain threshold? Maybe automatically make all saferooms that are sealed off from 30 minutes or more open up. Give survivors their old skills, maybe open some weapon locker and let them free. Obviously saferoom is a good hold location, thus survivors should be able to hold it.
Why even make this failsafe? Some rounds marines cant even leave FOB, or get wiped out in a single flank by the queen and they might NEVER reach the saferoom. Obviously its not fun for anyone to sit in one locked room, forced to RP for an hour, with nothing else to do, while once in a while some pipe blows up.
I cannot explain to you how happy it makes me that someone is actively interested in improving the current survivor gameplay and making it more roleplay focused. No longer having to locker hide and pray that I get to go shipside is gonna be amazing. I honestly have little issues with what you wrote, I think it has amazing soul and will be a net positive. It brings the focus back to RP and makes it a lot more than just sitting behind cades and spamming molotovs.
My only suggestions are that:
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The survivors themselves should be able to lift the panic room lockdown after 15-20 minutes of having pressed the button, to assure that if worst comes to worst and no marine stumbles upon them they can let themselves out.
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I know you’re gonna get a LOT of flack for the loosing skills thing (and just making it a roleplay role in general), but I think it is THE best thing that has happened to survivor in a very long time. Survivors redeploying to go frag out with the marines as a PFC+ is my biggest gripe with the role. I would love to see the survivor role be made more accessible for the more roleplay oriented players. I highly suggest you stay tooth and nail on this one, its a very important part of the change.
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I think alongside this some of the more ‘extreme’ weapons should be removed to encourage players to focus more on speed and avoiding contact rather than just going Rambo. Flamethrowers, most fully automatic weaponry, etc should just be flat out removed.
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Maybe this could finally give a use to the old deprecated PACMAN generators? Maybe a way to speed up the process would be to recover a PACMAN and it would make it so you need ‘x’ less amount of fuel (assuming you have the phoron for the PACMAN).
I could foresee some really interesting scenarios with this NGL. Like that one moment from Dark Descent where the PMC operator is solo protecting the civilians (https://youtu.be/QMCG9A80L50?si=iUoPsJIb8Lm1T_e4&t=2079). The RP opportunities there are endless. Maybe the civilians will help the CLF insurgent and convince the CO that he should be pardoned for saving them, etc.
1 Like
This is all stuff that usually gets answered /in/ development and testing.
Erm, yes. It should take nearly 15 minutes on average to do. That’s the time table we’re going for.
Don’t tweak out about the adrenaline crash thing just yet, it was just an idea, not necessarily a part of the plan.
Not an immediate concern.
Yeah this is probably a good idea.
My point about the skills and adrenaline rush stuff, and I guess the project in general, is that we can make a LOT of additional changes here to early round balance so that survivors don’t get absolutely cooked by Xenos when they are roaming, and we can use a feature like the adrenaline crash to remove enhanced skills, if we were to give survivors them temporarily.
What’s important about this, and what your key takeaways should be, is that survivor gameplay is becoming 15 minutes of roaming, followed by a few minutes of isolation that starts right before drop, instead of the current metarush directly into a molotov spam hold on top of the LZ. It will make the round more dynamic, give survivor players more action, give xenos more to engage with, and give you all a nice little break period to roleplay and wind down prior to being rescued. Then you can still do whatever, but not with END 5 or some shit.
It’s also probably worth mentioning to everyone else who will inevitably read this thread that I don’t have to make this post. I don’t have to share my ideas with the community. I could very well keep them to myself and just silently throw this PR up without listening to a word of feedback, but I don’t, because I do care. Some survivor players have been not so nice to me about trying to make these changes, which happens to be a recurring theme surrounding the role. I put a lot of my own valuable time and effort into the development of this game, don’t be the moron who takes it for granted.
4 Likes
So is it forced to have to enter the safe room or are we forced to do the objectives for the safe room or can we roam and have our fun of pvping as surv and make our cade holds as we already have done?
As overall this just seems like 15 minutes of rushing for the trash cans fighting t1s and t2s just to afk for another 5 - 15 minutes then come out of the safe room with skills nerfed and shit and just be liaison +
So the surv loop is there but just more boring in my opinion. Also there is more xenos than survs and I can already see the plat queens asking drones to make a cluster construction and leave it there without filling it up for noobie John surv to destroy it and alert the whole hive that survs are there like they have done on Solaris north podlocks in the past.
1 Like
To someone hellbent on powergaming and winning. This isn’t 5-15 minutes of afk, it is 5-15 minutes of RP. If you don’t want to, don’t play survivor. Spawn as PFC, get geared up, afk in DS, then game.
Remember the “medium rp” tag? Every single RP opportunity can be boiled down to “afk” and this is a toxic behaviour.
Metagaming is against the rules, you know? And I don’t think this would be hard to enforce either.
The ammount of cliques on the server is terrifying. Pred clique, synth clique, MP clique, surv clique, OT clique, research clique, this shit is getting annoying.
“Oh no, don’t touch my precious synth/predator/survivor/OT/whatever, oh that is 10 minutes of afk, oh this is balanced by RNG, oh this and oh that”.
I personally don’t like both current surv and the proposed rework (but rework seems to have potential to be much, much better anyway). I think CM survs should go Alien: Isolation route. Survs becoming invisible on xeno X-Ray, survs being able to make (or use civilian versions) MDs, flamethrowers, guns, nades and such just as Amanda Ripley could. Xenos could have some sort of mechanic that forces them to run back to the hive if sufficiently damaged (otherwise they die, but they should be almost 100% certain to be able to run back) before marines drop and such to simulate scaring them off.
The main goal would be to hide, but secondary goal would be to help marines in some way so survs could just try to survive, or if they want challenge, they can try to gather those fuel cans to help.
There of course should be also something to prevent survivors for staying in the same area for too long, so there is no getting into one closet and AFKing there till marines show up.
4 Likes
As a pre-word I wish to say that, honestly, Survivor should be able to go both PFC and RP routes for people who wish to play that kind of round for themselves. Forcing all people to RP on ship later will just cause most, if not almost every single one, current survivor players to just drop the role and never play it again, meaning shifting the power dynamic into the xeno’s hands for a WHILE until new survs learn the role and manage to reliably survive.
Best case scenario, imo, if adrenaline crash is implemented is to make it last until roughly around an hour passed since round start, to allow survivor players that wish to go down and kill again to do so. If they want they can RP shipside, sure, but they also may just go AFK if they want.
15 minutes to roam around with your buddies, but then can you fortify up the saferoom to hold off xenos for a bit before closing, or are you forced to close it as soon as possible?
Making lockerhiding the main gameplay feature of survivor isnt really a good idea, because hiding is boring. I do like the removal of X-Ray from xenos while they hunt survivors, making it a more high-risk high-reward to go off alone, but overall this would just ruin any kind of team-game between survivors and make xenos even less inclined to engage with it, cause it would boil down to going off in groups to click lockers, tackle down the stunned surv and then hug them in hive.
2 Likes
colonial marines is a deathmatch game im not gonna waste my survivor round talking for an hour straight thats just dumb
3 Likes
Honestly, super unfair and scummy to call someone who wants to shoot xenos for 20 minutes a powergamer. Its almost pathetic, what are you calling powergaming?
People should be able to play how they want, add the bunker for people who want to use it as an option but there should be an option for people who actually want to kill xenos to play as well.
Survivor has always been a vanilla role, you make what your round comes to be out of it. There’s no reason why handholding needs to be done when, surprise you can actually make a bunker yourself.
I dont like molotov spam, I dont like R wall spam, I like to play the game, on a hold, fast paced HVX action. What bunker is going to do is basically make molotov and Rwall spam with another flavor: Needing Fuel. People already rush booze dispensors and plasteel, I guess those people will rush fuel now and sit in there for 20 minutes like they do now.
Still, super sad to formulate your response as trying to stop “powergamers” and “hellbent winners” from doing whatever you think they are doing.
9 Likes
I mean. People already complain about lockerhiders, which this would reinforce in a way. So I can already imagine the salt of “power gamer” survs who see that half of them want to go bunker, and then being mad they won’t hold with the others.
But in any case, I see this as a net positive, since not only does this conform with cades being nerfed with the LZ update, it also makes it so survs don’t just camp one of two places on the map 99% of the time.
1 Like
I find this a good idea.
Don’t want to sit in a bunker until marines land? Are you allergic to RP?
Simply stay outside and shoot at big virtual bugs, nobody’s forcing you to B-line the shelters, simple 
it also makes it so survs don’t just camp one of two places on the map 99% of the time.
Aha… so instead of holding 2-3 places on map, survs will hold in 1 bunker every time and xenos will be able to just camp entrance to bunker knowing it’s the their only safe space.
1 Like
Forget the bunkers, just give us dropships or something, which we can repair on each map, escaping, instead of sitting pointlessly in a bunker until the marines “decide” to come get you, or they die before they can even reach you and you’re trapped there all round.
I wouldn’t even care so much if we were sent to an ERT station, as long as it was a choice or not, the bunkers aren’t really a good idea.
Also it would allow the people who wanna go off and RP to have a safe place and an easy escape, just let the others have the choice of staying or not, don’t get away from cades completely also, fuck that - if you do, buff survivors otherwise it will be a slaughter if we’re always forced to roam.
3 Likes
So basically you want to turn survivor gameplay into 15 min L4D loop, which is honestly not a bad idea fundamentally, expect for a few bad takes imo:
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Adrenaline crash - makes 0 sense RP wise and in just common sense wise, how a person loses his engi/med/weapon skills after adrenaline stop pumping? Max I would expect your endurance completely plummeted. How one even RPs this without sounding silly?
Either don’t give enchanted skills in the first place so there will be 0 need for crash or give adrenaline crash’s duration like 30-20 min max. Forcing combat heavy role to suddenly sit in a room with Liason/somewhere in Alamyer and do fuck all is unfun. -
Bunker placement itself - xenos overtime 100% gonna figure out that instead of chasing survivors while they’re searching for trash/objective, they can just camp/fortify with resin walls entrance to bunker, even if bunker entrance will add some sort of OP turrets to make them fuck off, they’ll just camp outside of its’ vision or other key road to it instead.
You can try to enforce rules on xenos to not camp those spots as a “meta knowledge”, but I’ve a feeling it’s going to be a nightmare for mods/admins online to babysit xenos not to abuse it and generally speaking xenos will just try to find the golden middle where they can’t get bwoinked and still camp near by
Thwomper, I’m not trying to be mean, but you’ve naive view of how xenos will play around this new feature. (saying this since you’re assuming that xenos will just chase roided survs on enchanted skills)
Also, I’ve few question regarding CLF/PMC/UPP inserts, what will happen to them? What will happen to loot on map, will it remain the same? Where will survivors spawn and will they spawn together like in CC?
Either way, thank you for reading people’s opinions and trying to improve server, Thowmper 
. I really hope you’ve best in mind for everyone who is playing our favourite autistic spessgame.
1 Like
I was implying on roaming instead of hunkering down
it appears to be as an option, but there could be a scenario where half will go roam and other half will go for bunker and when they’ll activate the bunker, roamer’s skills will get nerfed.
But I see your point, you’re not wrong about it in a vacuum. It’s just there’s potential for griefing and just overall forceful nature to RP instead of making RP itself seem more appealing is what making people upset.