Survivor Rework

General Discussion
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medical survs, engi survs probably gonna lose their firearms skill, might get buffed endurance while surving etc to make them able to fight in the open more, etc, we’ll see, it’s a balance knob we can tweak is the main point, if survs are too squishy we can bump their endurance so they’re a little more resistant etc and it won’t allow them to redeploy with endurance 50000 and wipe the floor.

you absolutely would not be losing skills relavent to your job as a survivor, doctor survs wont lose their surgery, engies won’t forget to make cades, etc.

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Good to hear that survivors will be able to (for the most part at least) keep their role specific skills, but I still cannot understand why support survivors should lose their weapons skills.

Using a gun on firearms 0 is basically impossible, so you’d be asking these guys to either become fob doc’s or MTs with loosened deployment restrictions. Ultimately, thats just gonna be a back and forth so i’ll keep reservations about this stuff for now unless/when the rework goes through, but I do foresee problems with these guys (myself included since I play engi 100% of the time) being unable to participate in anything combat anymore.

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Could you elaborate further on the ‘randomness’ you plan for the loot system? Will we still retain guaranteed high-tier loot spawners deep inside xeno territory (think Fiorina), or will it be entirely chance based? I can’t help but feel like it would be more appropriate for high-tier loot to be guaranteed, as otherwise it will lead to frustration for survivors when it doesn’t spawn, and frustration for xenos when it does spawn and they get caught off-guard or haven’t learned how to play against it. Additionally, there’s a trade-off between randomness and defensibility - at least the drones most of the time have the ability to attempt to defend mining caves and/or melt the guns, whereas extended randomness could lead to unavoidable situations of rock paper scissors where xenos can only defend a few of the loot spawns. Finally, I do think that it can be fun for both sides to play with and against a strong weapon, I’ve had a lot of fun playing with and against the MAR-50 specifically in CLF inserts.

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So, what I think I might be interested in doing is creating a loot table per each map, and having the garbage bins or cache things you search to find the fuel canisters drop a random loot item if not a fuel canister. Those random items could literally be anything. Ideally, all the freaky ass loot like SADARs and thermal stuff is removed from maps themselves so getting them isn’t a matter of how quick you get there. We can then stick the crazy stuff in the random loot pool at a super rare chance, so you get loot while following the objective. Could be neat.

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(Notice: I forgot to click to post button a day or two ago, whoops)

I’ve suggested something like this previously. I won’t write a big tedtalk but I’ll list my thoughts

Personally, I think the survivors should spawn together (or have the option to)

I think that loot should also be randomly spawned across the map (each side hates the idea of having to rush certain areas, this may remove it, perhaps the objectives may be things they must find as well, encourage higher risk things)

I enjoy the equipment failing mechanic, but this shouldn’t kill the survivors, it should at most, force them out of the area (or perhaps climb in to cryostasis pods they can be “SAVED” from by marines). Forcing them to die will just have people refusing to go in the safezones, as well as increasing salt towards marines.

I think the loss of skills would be detrimental and would lead to the thing I hate, survivors getting shipside and then just cryoing because they have nothing to do.

I do think that the “Molotov spam” comment does show a somewhat outdated view of survivors, I consider myself a survivor player (yet rather seperate from the cliques) and it’s not something I’ve seen in sometime (or, tbh at all, especially compared to HOW common it was)

I do have concerns with the CLF/PMC/UPP inserts, I honestly enjoy these due to the fact it allows players to inject some uniqueness which was once reserved for events. I think not covering these facts or at least coming up with a rough idea is a mistake.

I do think bunker placements would only work if it was a completely random spawn spot (eg, z level prepper bunker, ladder/hatch spawns somewhere, (Maybe invisable to xenos but needs a large windup to climbin?)

I like many of these ideas, and I do think that you are making the right choice by opening a dialogue overall. My advice is, perhaps grab a few people you can work with directly and use them as a small group which can give you constructive input, (I’d advise even including those you disagree with a lot, if only to have someone counter your points)

Good luck with it.

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I’m working on some further things for them to do after surviving, like actual mechanical things beyond just PFC+ or whatever.

I agree that it shouldn’t kill them, but little tasks to maintain the bunker to keep them on their toes after a while could be fun and good roleplay.

I see it every so often.

I have several options to pursue, discussing with management before we bring them to the public discourse.

Completely random might be a map issue, but I’m hoping to have several options at a time.

Way ahead of you.

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You don’t need complete randomness. Just have like, up to 20 spots on the map, that are “invisable” until a survivor opens the lid. Number depends on the map (LV just needs like, 8 at minimum).

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You could make it somewhat dependand on what surv roles survive. Like how you would need an engine surv to fix something, research surv to fix their ID card for points, etc. like just make it a very mini SS13 experience.

At least this way you reward survs for not all picking security survivor for the gun skills and whatever (as cades will be nerfed).

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Man this is why I wanted a shuttle to escape in instead, makes more sense, Engi for repairs, someone who is Pilot to fly it ect. Stuff like that.

Thematically just hiding in a bunker isn’t as cool as escaping on a shuttle.

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It’s like I said, I don’t think that super rare chances are a satisfying mechanic for either side, nor do I think that loot pools should be standardized. The risk of getting good items from the xeno side of the map is engaging!

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Nerf cades for survivors (less materials overall), give each survivor a decent loadout, and make their objective to escape via a shuttle.

If they escape, they get rewarded with an “upgraded class” that comes to the Almayer via an ERT shuttle and said ERT shuttle leaves 2 minutes afterwards. The “upgrade” would either be random or based on the map, such as UPP on Sorokyne, PMC’s on Trijent / Solaris, nerfed Dutches Dozens on LV-642 (because survival on that map without cades is next to impossible so why not), etc.

The “upgraded” survivors can now choose to side with the Almayer and deploy, or stay on ship and roleplay.

Thats my only opinion of survivor rework.

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Congratulations, you just described the current survivor gameplay loop. :patrice:

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Exactly.

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I know this might be out of scope, but giving special survivor objectives to inserts could be looked at. Like the WY one on LV could have its only bunker in corpo dome, and you need to find X amount of WY docs to get in.

Just more flavor to them could help a long way.

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